This file includes most of the variant-specific commentary; general game comments may be found in the "suggest.txt" file. ======================================================================== Please comment on any variant that is especially good, bad, or otherwise interesting: "I think that Oangband, PernAngband, and UnAngband (and also Gumband...) are great examples of the multitude of directions that Angband can take; each has made choices and innovations that have advanced the game in many ways, and yet are very different from each other and from my own variant. I think it's very important for me to keep that in perspec-tive and not fall into the trap of believing that there is any "right" way a variant must be developed in." -- Eytan Zweig ======================================================================== a1) [Standard Angband, or Vanilla Angband, or simply Angband] Nice, sweet and simple. Plain good stuff. :) When 3.0.0 comes out, I'll probably be playing a lot of it again. the standard, bit iffy now i got used to the OAngband combat in Z but still fun to play When something is this good to work from (And I have seen nothing but improvements for Robert) its hard to ignore. The best, and I still have to beat it... Somehow I always return to this no matter how good the other variants look. Still the standard, and my favorite. Haven't played this in ages. Too vanilla for my liking :) needs more convenience features to avoid becoming irrelevant The best version of course Very good and stable, lots of fun. Only recently started playing this again. It seems to be more fun now - of course that could be because I'm autoscumming these days... Elegant, simple and well-designed fun. Nothing silly about it, and done so well that I keep coming back. The best, in my opinion. I've been trying to play a bit more of this recently,thanks to Ceilti's suggestion of leaving preserve mode off. The JLE Patch lends some novelty to proceedings, and I hope will make things more consistently interesting. get rid of floor stacking. or at least make it an option. after all, maximize is an option and that's just as retarded imho as you think not floor stacking is. Love it. Will always love it. But am currently tweaking the 2.9.6 alpha versions to put the spells, monster and other lists back to the original 2.9.3 versions. The scripting changes have made this a royal pain. The first, the greatest, the best. Needs to be simplified and brought back to its simpler roots. Let the variants do the interesting things. classic. my favourite. I haven't played this recently since there are so many variants out there to try (I really should try a game with the JLE patch to see if it is much different). I also prefer variants which let mages be mages. In V, mages must do a lot of melee late in the game. It's alive! I may be one of its critics, and do dislike some of the new changes, but the fact that it is actively maintained is worth almost any price. Thank you, RR. The best, I still have to beat it. The real thing. Finally moving again. It's really nice, I wish the magic system was a little better. The Standard is the Standard because it's well balanced, approachable, and is known well enough to analyze. If variants are like races in a variant, Angband is the "human" - well-rounded, dominant in society because of that, and the base against which all others are going to be judged. [V] needs the difficulty progression smoothed down and the interest level raised -- either by forcing autoscum on or by finding some way to make it obsolete. Well this is where it all started, and the one I'm most familiar with. Haven't even seen below stat gain in any other variant yet. Clean, good fun! And fairly well-balanced. Nice base. It's good to see that Robert has started adding more stuff; I came into the community after Ben had started to be inactive, and it was a bit worrying to see Vanilla just petrify... It's amazing that it's still fun to play after all these years... 5 years and counting... still aching to beat this game. The base from which all variants are derived. Everyone should play vanilla for a while before they try the variants. It's the least common denominator but is very robust wrt game-play and UI. Best of all. I play it only for an occasional challenge-game. It's otherwise rather boring. ======================================================================== ) [Angband--] two positive mentions of Angband---: For one thing, it was THE Angband variant for many, many years (partly because it was, well, the only one in existence); there were many winner posts, with almost all the winners beating the Serpent of Chaos with either Twilight or a holy avenger mace of disruption. It also was the inspiration for ZAngband, which is based on Angband--. (If you don't believe me look at the documentation for ZAngband 1.2.) It's historically more important than any other variant, so it's a pity that the modern Angband player, even highly clued players like you and Julian Lighton, isn't even aware that it exists, or existed. (Does someone have a copy?) ======================================================================== a2) [Angband/64] I liked the info about where the objects were found. Never managed to get it to work on my computer without crashing. I like the spellbook system and the character creation method a lot, but there are *too many* traps! Really, really neat. The best arena going, traps that set the standard, a really nice birth process, and stores with character. Be sure to make backup savefiles, because it is (whisper it) a tad buggy. Used to crash on me too often in old times. Recently, I found out that its 'teacher mode' at least gives a great character creator (better thajn anything vanilla has to offer). Worth more attentions. Nice variety in traps and monsters A bear to try and play. Astonishingly inventive without sacrificing traditional *band values. ======================================================================== b1) [Bangband] (no comments) ======================================================================== b2) [BeAngband] ... I threw together in a couple of days so more people could try some of the newer patches. Among these was the AutoSquelch patch, so I claim some credit for getting AutoSquelch into the mainstream, even though all BEAngband was, was applied patches and compiling for windows. ======================================================================== c1) [Cat and the hack Angband (CathAngband)] Love the option to remove destroyed levels, and wood elf rangers. Nightmare mode is fun too. Not very happy about the lack of magic mushrooms, but the naked singularity is fun... [CatH 2.9.1.3] has CONFER_* flag given to Ring of Element and some other stuff. It confers brand/slay to weapon. Wear =oFlames and Short Sword gives Short Sword of Burning etc. Paur* gloves have CONFER_* making them useful. There is also the possibility that you could wield Glaive of Pain and confer 3 brands/slays (with right equip.), I don't know if anyone has checked yet(?) I only downloaded it the other night, but from what I've seen so far, I like it. I've played this four or five times. It does seem to have a little more originality to offer than most variants (where you might as well play Vanilla unless you play one of the new races). On the other hand it hasn't induced me to play it regulalrly yet. Nice ideas for warriors and crit hits there, within the context of the original Angband combat system rather than the completely different OAngband one. Not sure how well they work but possibly worth a try. This looked really awesome, but then it stopped. But maybe it's starting again. Familiar to anyone who knows vanilla, but with neat new stuff. Fun without being imbalanced. ======================================================================== c2) [Cthulhu Angband (CthAngband)] Last played it when Dean(?) was maintainer. Really liked the multiple dungeons, but wasn't keen on the new speed system (even though I won with it), and never tried the skills system which was later introduced. Tried this once and it seemed quite nice, but Z is my one true love and i can never be unfaithful for long. That and a non-O combat system just weird me out now :) Kinda weird, but fun to play This might have had a better wilderness generation system. I play this quite a lot. The multiple dungeons allow a character to advance relatively rapidly, and it seems to be easier to get artifacts at a level where they make an enormous difference to a character, rather than where they are the only vaguely interesting thing left in a sea of boring enchantment. The Lovecraftian monsters also add a distinctive and coherent element. This variant offers a sort of 'auto-scum experience' - very dangerous at times, with correspondingly high rewards to those who survive. However, I gather that the latest versions (to which I have no access) include some fairly radical changes, to such a degree that the current Cthangband may bear little relation to the game I know and love. The first to really take seriously the concept of multiple dungeons with different guardians. Shame about the new speed system - which seems to have never really taken off, and may have put some people off the rest of the game before the change of maintainer. The skill system makes the game too easy to win (one can be an expert at just about everything). I like the themed dungeons. Also good value. Rapid-firing magic missiles, dim-dooring around, a little hack-n-slash for variety, new cthulu monsters, themed dungeons, totally original "spirit bound" system of magic; was a good experience. Yes, the speed system needs real changes before CthAngband is ready for the masses. Yes, it honestly think that it can be made to work. Has my favorite implementation of over-world and multiple dungeons. But I don't like the skill system. The 'spirits' idea leads to my favorite priest-type "class". Unfortunately, there are still too many Z-things and vanilla things and not enough cthulhu-monsters. (but I admit I haven't played very much since 4.0.0). Many interesting ideas, I enjoy the multiple dungeons and the skill system. Good theme - though I'd like to see a few remaining silly things get removed or replaced. Skill system could use some adjusting as well, and documentation really needs to be improved. But still, the most fun of the variants, in my opinion. The only things it needs are a more elaborate skill system and horses, IME. Excellent game. This would be my favorite variant hands down if the experience system was a bit more user-friendly, say, giving you messages every so often when you fail to gain experience because you're bored. Grokking it as it is now, in my experience, requires you to hold way too much information in your head at one time, or else use cheat sheets, which is rarely any fun. A little bit of pandering to confused players here would go a long way, it seems to me. Right now this is too hardcore for me. Has very good atmosphere and strikingly different system. There was an older version of CthAngband that I played a LOT and really, really liked. This got worse when the skill system was introduced. The skill system is interesting, seems to work quite well ======================================================================== d1) [Dennis van Es' Angband (DvEband)] Never got a good working weapon skill system. Still like the wall of fire spell. Remarkable for varying weapon skills for different classes. The one feature Vanilla needs. ======================================================================== d2) [Discworld Angband (Discband)] I play this now and then, although I find the misspellings annoying (to the degree that I compiled an entire list, with corrections, and e-mailed them to the author - to no avail). This is basically Zangband 2.4.0 with a different face. A lot of the uniques have become friendly, which makes life a good deal easier - on the other hand, I never get very far when playing! The most outstanding feature of Discband in my mind is that it is the only variant for which I have sound support configured *on* - since [Z] supports so many extra sound events, enlarging Angband's somewhat limited repertoire. ======================================================================== d3) [Drangband] really pre-dated the whole "lots of silly races" craze. gimme a few more rings :) Too munchkin I think.. Dragons are fun to play. "Hey! Wouldn't it be cool to play as a dragon!" [Ed: it IS cool!] ======================================================================== e1) [Easy-Angband (Easyband)] Does it really need to be made any easier? I understand that it is challenging to begin with, but that's how you end up getting better. Easyband only makes it *harder* for people to get better at Angband. ======================================================================== e2) [Eric Bock's Angband variant (Eric-band)] (no comments) ======================================================================== e3) [Eytan Zweig's Angband (EyAngband)] Fun stuff. Potion mixing is cool. Mystics were a neat new spell-caster derivative. Some neat new races and monsters to fight as well. Haven't stolen anything so far, but there's always next week. Eytan is that rara avis among maintainers, who has a coherent plan for development, and integrates his changes with a lot of care. And it's paid off in a tremendous variant Played it a few times, Eytan has done a good job with this. It was obvious to me that considerable effort has been put into it. I really like this variant for several reasons. I think Eytan has some great ideas, nothing earth-shattering but it all adds up to a cohesive gameplaying experience. I especially like his quest implementation and the weapon prefixes. I keep on swearing that I'm going to try this one one day. Then I take another look at vanilla and find myself playing that again instead... but I do like the look of some of the things from EyAngband. Including the idea of ego-item light sources. Interesting - some nice features overall. I like the new races (Angels and Demons) and classes. I only tried it once or twice, but liked the quest shop - I think that could have a place in V without totally changing it. Downloaded, played, didn't notice anything which wanted to make me stick to this... and don't have enough time to thouroughly try out every variant, so I've let this one be for now. My second favorite variant, for the reasons I stated above [ed: interface, stat system]. Sadly, I haven't been playing much Ey, because I got obsessed with O, but when 0.4.0 comes out I'll probably get into it again. My variant of choice. love ego-lanterns. Ey is running very fast in right direction. :) Many user interface improvements worth being exported to others, including the standard game. Demons and Angels, great concept for skill increase over levels Really like this one. Percentile resistances, Felpurr, the quest system, and frequent updates, but still can't get used to the stat system (0-40? rather than 3-18/220) The demon and angel classes are really creative and interesting. I really like that the traits of the race change over the course of the game. While I haven't seen any in the game, I know this has removed angels from the dungeon, which I like. I don't like thinking of angels as "bad guys" in the dungeon to be destroyed. Another favorite is the magic lanterns. And, as mentioned above, I think the Mystic and Bard classes are very interesting. The Angel and Demon races are interesting. I'd love to see this one with O combat. ======================================================================== f1) [Fangband] First *band i played, also only one i ever found Feanor in so far... ======================================================================== g1) [Goingband] (no comments) ======================================================================== g2) [GSN-Angband, GSN2-Angband] These two try very hard to make balanced variants and do a pretty good job of it. Fun to play. A lot more worthwhile than the maintainer will have you think. Sure, it was buggy, but I'd rather have fun than perfect code any day. The original GSN was like KAngband, only better, but I don't quite understand the intent behind GSN2. Of course, I've not played it since 1999, so that might have something to do with it. ('99 was two years ago now? I feel old...) I really like the changed magic system and the novice stat-gain (which is probably a bug or something). But there are a few things (why does Outpost suck so bad?) which make this difficult to play. In general, though, enjoyable. ======================================================================== g3) [Gumband] Good stuff and some great material to turn into a *band I have a sort of sick fascination with this game: for whatever reason, I don't get sick of watching my ghost mindcrafters get toasted by Gothmog... Another fun variant. I play this occasionally when i'm feeling nostalgic for the old versions of Z I ought to play this sometime. Joseph William Dixon appears to have done a nice job of creating a Moorcock-based variant. I have played it a fair bit. Astral mode is great. :) A lot of logical ideas in it, too. This is the one I keep on swearing that I'm going to try one day instead of playing older 2.1.x versions of ZAngband. But never quite get around to it. One of two variants (the other being older versions of PernAngband) which really carries on the necessary tradition of old-style ZAngband - it's zany, it's fun, and to hell with balance. ;-) I played this for a bit. No kidding, the lack of auto-open and the changed color scheme are what really put me off it. Sorry. Very good original zangband variant. Fun to play. Played mainly with ghosts. I don't really like the referencde to that group. Lots of iffy additions. Ghost start is absofucking wonderful. End monsters are too easy (w/Stormbringer anyway). Guaranteeing Stormbringer as it exists is awful. ======================================================================== g4) [GW-Angband] Like the mage Played one or other of these at the same time as Goingband - whichever one it was didn't seem at all distinctive, so again I deleted it. I've since gathered that it is supposed to have interesting new spells... this was a good attempt at a reasonable mage. mage spells still underpowered for my taste. i also like the improvements to rogue. i never tried the gw priest but remember there was some work done there too. Of all the variants which invent new spells and magic systems and try to have mages behaving more like mages, this is my preference. I don't play it, but I'd like to see some of the more useful (and particularly the more damaging) spells make their way into vanilla, in place of some of the less useful or duplicated spells. Keleks, and Sorcery And Evocations, in particular, could do with a couple of higher-damage spells than vanilla mages have right now. I still think its the best balanced variant to date. These two try very hard to make balanced variants and do a prtyy good job of it. Fun to play. Nice mage. For heaven's sake, don't import the spell docs with the spells! I really should play this more. It is the variant Vanilla should learn from. Played this a lot, but can't remember how it played like. Best balanced of these all. Really love playing mage here. ======================================================================== h1) [Hengband] great ideas, need docs Was looking forward to this till I heard about the double move "feature"... Some very interesting ideas, tho it all felt a bit too weird for me :) my current obsession. LOVE the different looking dungeons, auto-pick has serious power All sorts of coolness. The detail of the new classes has to be sen to be believed. I am especially fond of the samurai class. With better English-language docs and in-game text, this variant will assuredly be as popular elsewhere as it is in Japan. Despite the good points brought up by others, I really do think that the speed system needs adjustment. I'm restricted to using floppies to move Angband variants, so I've not played Heng yet, but it sounds outstanding. Horses in a playable roguelike (not Nethack)! At last! Whee! This is like Z in its greatest days, except more. It's made more exciting because I can't read the source code (the Japanese characters mess up Alpha something awful). I'm a Pern coder. So... Competition is a good thing. Haven't got a chance to really dig in here, but looks great. Playing an Android is completely different - focused on looking for high-level objects to wear (from which they gain experience) rather than killing monsters (which gives no experience) ======================================================================== i1) [IronMan-Angband] ah, that was a great fad, ingband. from-the-top is one of my fave game styles. in this, and other variants, i've played hundreds of characters named "Random Diver XX", which are random race and class, and are fated never to return to the town... ======================================================================== k1) [Kangband] I started playing this recently; I like the quests (nice to have a bit of a storyline). I like the quests, but they get repetitive (sp?) in time. Kangband's good cos it's like Zangband without the unnecessary stuff. The 'old' version of this, where you had an extended town (in the days befoe other variants introduced it) and were more or less guaranteed artifacts every five levels or so from your Guild, but had to return to the town to learn any spells, was distinctive and I used to play it a lot. The 'revised old' version dropped most of what distinguished it from Vanilla, I believe in order to upgrade it to a later version of the Vanilla codebase. As a result I've almost stopped playing it. I don't have access to the current developments, so I'll probably never know what's going on with Kangband now. Kangband has the potential to be a great variant but not until I can find the time to make it so. Its already a good variant for people making the transition from standard Angband to something like Pern/Zang since it has many features of both yet is still fairly similar to Angband. Great for those who like set quests. Lousy for those who don't. I haven't tried newer versions yet, but I hear some of the rewards are a bit out of whack. The birth of varied terrain in a modern Angband. The original source of the varied towns and stores available in many variants. This variant has had a lot of influence, and deservedly so. While the quests seem to be somewhat abusable, I enjoyed them a lot more than those in Z. Arena is fun! ======================================================================== k2) [Kamband] loved the ball spell system and all the creative changes. liked the towns, specially the arena Trippy :) Very unbalanced. Most monsters seem to end up getting killed by other, 'friendly' monsters. Almost all dungeon objects are either horribly cursed or astonishingly (and unbalancingly) good. You can pick up two or three artifacts on the town level by braving the 'zoo'... The ghost mode is a lot of fun - though insta-deaths, from coming up/down stairs and getting breathed on in the first turn, are not only frequent but eventually inevitable. The Guild rewards for several classes are bugged, causing the game to crash with a corrupted savefile, and it is all too easy to get stuck inside the Arena with no means of exit. This is the only *band I allow myself to play after midnight, on the grounds that carelessness really makes no difference to your chances of getting gratuitously killed here! It has taken over from Kangband as my munchkinish power-play variant of choice. I will always love Ghost Beastmasters but I gave up playing this variant when Ivan impemented those awful breaking weapons. Too buggy, but lots of interesting ideas (some of which are in Pern now). The variant I turned to when I wanted something really crazy. I appreciate the new intro docs; they make the game philosphy much clearer, and help me get into the right frame of mind to enjoy Kamband. The variant farthest out, as far as I can see. I went through a long period where I would just start Kam characters and get them to level 35 or so, wearing eight or nine artifacts, without entering the dungeon. Artifact weapons make weapon damage silly, by the way. In general, I enjoyed it, and the later changes towards greater info file customization were great, but I'm not sure it was Angband per se. I'd enjoy this if weapons weren't damaged by using them. Totally insane, but fun.. The major differences from other *bands can make it a refreshing change from the standard *bands.. I've only ever found Ringil once in the entire time I've played *band, and it was in Kam....at 450'.. ======================================================================== l1) [Langband] Now this is the one variant I think that deserves its own award. If at times I have felt like I have laboured in the wilderness, I just have to think of Langband.... ======================================================================== m1) [Michael Barnes' Angband (MJband)] (no comments) ======================================================================== m2) [Multi-player Angband (Mangband)] Nice, I wish there were more people online though. Maybe a time could be set up to play at some point.. Tried a couple times, and reached the conclusion that Angband and Multi- player, in my opinion, are two things which definitely do not go well together. Fascinating stab at an untenable concept. ======================================================================== n1) [New Angband (NewAngband)] Very strange. Multiclass system is a good idea, but frustrating to use so I haven't really played around with it much ======================================================================== n2) [Non-Tolkienian Angband (NTAngband)] ======================================================================== o1) [Oangband] I WILL get a character to level 40 one of these days... Soon, hopefully. Lots of fun, though. I especially like how the power levels have been reduced across-the-board. And the changes in how mages play. Oh man, this game has driven me crazy like nothing else! It's just so well designed and planned, features Leon Marrick's sparkling prose, and, more than any other variant, presents a fully-realized, seamless world. Just different enough from Vanilla to keep things interesting, without feature bloat. Now if it weren't just so HARD... One day I'll beat this game: maybe I'll have to quit my job first. It's much better to have an opinion. ;) I still can't get my head round the combat system - maybe it would help if the game was a little easier too. Must try it agian sometime. Leon Marrick is probably the best variant designer ever due to his complete vision for the variant (rather than just "here are some cool things I want to add"). Has its charms, but I gave up on it after a while. I think I needed to find a good character/race combination - rangers seemed underpowered compared to Vanilla, which I didn't like. Ergh, a very nice variant but too damned difficult, Those evil evil crows of durthang or whatever have killed every character so far i think :) Good variant, lots of good ideas Every now and then I try a number of chars, but I can't get used to the combat system. Oangband's Software Bug. Not only is it really, really annoying from a gameplay POV, I hate joke monsters, especially in an otherwise solid variant like Oangband. Spent a fair bit of time playing it, but I still prefer the [V] combat system. The [O] combat system is far more logical, but the [V] one is a lot more fun/lends itself to faster games, so it wins. :) Have only played melee classes in it so far, I really should try a magic user, or so I've been told. This is probably the variant that most interests me in terms of new developments - I'm still stuck playing, I think, 0.4.0, but have some hopes of seeing a stable version that will work on my machine at some unspecified time in the future. I don't like the sound of the total helplessness of the new [O] mages in hand-to-hand combat - it doesn't make a lot of sense in role-playing terms (surely, before they've wasted their adult years away in booklearning, apprentice mages are as rumbustious as any other 'prentice boys?) - and as I've never got a Vanilla mage up to stat gain, let alone the endgame, I'd be more worried about making the early game impossibly dangerous than rebalancing the end-game. (Isn't it [Cth] where Mindcrafters start off as reasonable melee fighters and get worse and worse as their magic skills get better and better? Wouldn't this be a better approach?) However, as all I know of the past year's developments is what I have heard on this newsgroup, I'm not really qualified to comment. I certainly like a lot of other things about [O]. I can't actually say I play it that much at the moment, though. What can I say? I love Oangband. Particularly necromancers. Some great ideas. Some not so great. But then, the maintainer did have some pretty weird opinions... ;-) I like the new and more-powerful wands and rods, and the artifact wands, rods and staves, but not the method of wand stacking (it works better for rods.) The Staff of Mana Storms should not be a Staff, as Staves' effects should IMHO be non-directional (no other Staff has a directional effect) - it would be better to make this a Wand instead. Not keen on the combat system, I prefer to be able to add up the numbers rather than rely on strange non-intuitive percentages which it's impossible to work out without resorting to advanced calculus, trigonometry, logarithmic tables and possibly quantum theory... and I like my early-game mages to stand a reasonable chance of hitting a grey mold with a dagger if the magic missile spell fails twice. Great approach to combat. Rest of it plays a bit too much like Z, though. Probably the most balanced and "sober" version, and the hardest of the ones I play regularly. Another one I should play more. Never got the hang of the combat system, and mages are somewhat hard to start. I'm not sure if I really like territory. I love rogues having special abilities but disagree on the trap implementation. [O]'s very early game difficulty needs toning down a bit, and the player ghosts need adjusting -- a player ghost at a depth can vary considerably in strength from wimpier to a unique of its depth to far too hard for that depth. Very interesting changes and ideas, and I'll be watching this one closely as it continues to evolve. I recently started looking at this... from what I've read, it sounds interesting. More differentiated classes sounds like a good thing, and balance and theme are always good things. Seems to have some interesting features. So far, the combat systems feels cludgy though... I'd like to have weapon damage shown on the character screen, to avoid having to go through all that math to figure out which one to use. Will keep trying this one for a few characters more and see if it's something to keep playing or not. Very good documentation (though still with some faults in my opinion). My favorite variant. It's like Angband, but with a whole nother game! Everything varies so much that I'm afraid my experience in O will not carry over to variants that stay closer to home (already I tend to forget to get light weapons for early warriors). I would like it even more except that I can't get past about 1000'. More practice is needed, I guess. This thing have some of the best ideas around. Way too hard for me, but it's fun. Sensible combat system? In Angband...? ;) I'm working on my own [O] spoilers. Maiar in [O] should get to pick a resistance from a list of all of them to have, and be able to change this during play. Not that I play Maiar... Does [O] take patches from other people? I have some ideas... shren Don't like the confusing combat-system. The only variant I've ever been tempted to try, and overall I liked it, particularly all the extra Tolkeinish stuff. If only default player ghosts named after Angband "personalities" and stupid "uniques talk during the fight" stuff was taken out, it'd be really excellent! :) SomeUnique says "i will r0x u!!!" SomeUnique says something "witty" about the "RNG" Destroy the atmosphere more plz. Getting better all the time :) Different combat system works well, some nice items This is the only other variant I've played to any extent. I like the revised magic system and the design philosophy behind the physical attack and damage system makes a lot of sense to me. Combination artifacts are a great idea and the Quiver is great for characters that are primarily archers. I praise it to the skies near every time I post. Has problems--many--but overall best out there. I've long called it vanilla+. The variant to try for dyed-in-the-wool vanilla players. I just love this. Blinding attacks are annoying, though. ======================================================================== p1) [Pangband] (no comments) ======================================================================== p2) [PernAngband] Played intensively - If I could I'd spend as much time developing as Dark God and friends and come out with the full fledged varient with wilderness, allies, quests etc. But I can't (At least not until I retire in 50+ years). Sorry guys. Very popular. I should play it some day. Wonderfully rich and possesses a sort of inspired lunacy, which more than compensates for some gameplay problems. One that I hope to explore further. Ack too much of a learning curve :) We either need a 500 page "players guide to pernangband" or an introductory version with only half the features *grin* seriously weird and deep, just what the jaded long-time player needs. also seriously annoying in some ways -- ie. inability to run in some dungeons. maintainer's energy is infectious. Pern...the whole variant is just very very interesting. Variant with the most new features, lots and LOTS of good stuff Overall I like Pern, but wish it was a bit more Pern-y. Oh Goddess. Don't get me started. I've never liked [P], and I doubt I ever will. In theory, a lot of [P] sounds good... then you actually play the thing and it shows you that theory isn't everything. ^_^ In my experience it is extremely buggy, with new bugs introduced all the time. Another thing that gets on my nerves is how I have to hike a fair distance back and forwards to the FIRST dungeon, until such time as I can save up some money for WoR. Realism is one thing, user friendless and sensibility is another. Bleh. This has the proud distinction of now being the first Angband variant to have swelled to dimensions too large to fit into my computer's memory even under the most extreme economy measures :-( Everything has been said about Pern that needs to be said about it. Take half of its features and you have your own variant. Pernband has improved significantly from my point of view over the last year. Like Hengband, I feel that it has too many features and possibil- ities and conseqently lacks a cohesive feel. I prefer a simpler, more consistent game. Still a lot of fun to play however. Brilliant but flaky. Getting better in the bug-demolition department, but still a tendency (exacerbated by the move to CVS and Sourceforge) to introduce new features *before* fixing old bugs (and, in extreme cases, *instead of* fixing them) rather than *afterwards*. Also needs a big slim-down in the number of classes, races and spellbooks. Not enough purely-bugfix re-releases: a version 5.0.1b that did nothing but fix the bugs in 5.0.1 should have been released long ago to the official Clockwork site. But this variant has the best handling of above-ground wilderness, of all variants. I would say that the handling of different dungeons with different guardian monsters is a bit clunky in the user interface, but I can't think of a better or more user-friendly way to express it, so I won't. Probably the least balanced and zaniest version, but *lots* of fun! I hope DarkGod never runs out of neat ideas (but has the time and interest to fix the bugs and add a little bit of game balance). PernAngband is pretty unusual and interesting. I really like the stronger Tolkien theme and the new wilderness, but I don't like the more complex game plot. My current RohanKnight Corrupted Unbeliever is hanging around past level 100 of Angband, waiting for Sauron to show up so he can get the One Ring for his quest; he's ready for Sauron, but the cowardly Dark Lord just won't show up! The variant that out Topis Topi Ylinen. If you are looking for a big, sprawling, colorful game experience, you can pick from a lot of variants, but PernAngband is likely to be high on the list. I love this variant, but the class/race/etc selection is a bit too complex for me to easily figure out, to be honest. A great experiment. I plan to write a roguelike, and I learn a lot more from Pern than from Vanilla. At times it's brilliant, at times it's as annoying as a brilliant light shining in your eyes. Well, to be honest I haven't tried 5.1 yet so it might just be brilliant now. :-) Take out half the classes and races, give it a bit more bugtesting and polishing, and I'd be sorely tempted to stop playing Vanilla. PernAngband, because a) it was the only flavour of Angband i've seriously played _at all_ last year and b) because its classes, races and even the bits of actual _plot_ injected into it made it so much fun i simply didn't _want_ to play another *band. This is the one that feels like it could have been a really good variant, but it lacks focus. Throw out various sillyness, cut down a little on the ridicolous amount of races/classes or rework them to be more interesting, and to get rid to all the more or less class-specific items. Lots of good ideas - I like the overview map and the different dungeons especially. Stop adding feature, and work on balancing and adding focus and removing bugs for a while, and this could turn into my favourite variant... but for now, it will have to remain the one I want to get into, but always gets turned off from after playing for a short while. Better organized documentation would help as well. Active as all heck, hopefully Darkgod will someday start unifying & balancing it... If Pern is Angband, it shouldn't require that powerful of a computer. If it's a CRPG, it should have NPC interaction. DarkGod, make up your mind! :) Pern is a wonderful variant, because you can do anything you want. But really I would play Pern just for the Sorcerors and Power-Mages. I just wish that there weren't so many class-specific items and other junk. Too big to tell in some words, or to fix bugs :) Tried once, stumbled into a Between gate, died horribly without having met a single monster. Haven't tried since. Lots of great stuff here! Runecrafters and sorcerors are my favorites Next on my list to play - Pern, and more MPern. I enjoyed dabbling with [P] (p2). Will hopefully find time to really try it. (I will need to get better at *band playing too) Lots of cool features added. Darkgod has a great capacity for adding features, but it is the one that most desperately needs good docs (mostly because it is different). Really strange (and good) variant. Haven't got far here. Will try more later. What is there to say, the new 5.1.0 is awsome! And with more graphics for 8x8, wohoo! :) Pern could do with stopping introducing new stuff and balancing some current ones The various quests and all the races/classes look very interesting, but I often lose interest if characters get deeper. Many different classes to play with, quests which involve more than just killing monsters Amusing. If I should ever get the urge to play Nethack again I'll play Pern instead. I played this for a little while, but didn't really like it. Way too much unnecessary stuff. ======================================================================== ) [PernMAngband] I'd never have learned how to use macros if it weren't for PernMAngband. ======================================================================== p3) [Prfnoff's Angband variant ()] (no comments) ======================================================================== p4) [Programmable Angband (PAngband)] (no comments) ======================================================================== p5) [Psionic-Angband (PsiAngband] Lots of fun, especially the psionicist class. My current *band winning goal. :) I've played this off and on, mostly rogues and psionicists (neither one of which tend to survive very long) and sometimes paladins and rangers (who get quite deep). I may have gotten the hang of psionicists, though: we'll see... I tried both of these and deleted them, since the gameplay didn't seem particularly distinctive (apart from the bolted-on psionics). Having learned of Jonathan Ellis' involvement, and some of the less-obvious features included, I now somewhat regret this. However, those were very old versions anyhow. The one I took over. Psionicists are still too weak at the beginning and too strong at the end (but I finally understand the reasons). Trap kits are fun, but a bit too compicated and too weak for the amount of inventory space they need. I will work on it when I have more time. ======================================================================== p6) [Psionic-Zangband (PziAngband] Played few times. Like it, but somehow lost interest. ======================================================================== q1) [Quest Angband (QAngband)] Deserves to be recognised for introducing random quests to *band (Z used the code from here). Also tried to make mages more mage-like (less armour and attacks, GoI less effective, spells do twice as much damage), and introduced a few new items, like rings of mana. ======================================================================== r1) [Realistic-Angband (Rangband)] It's not quite dead yet, but I don't know when it'll see activity again. Having the source lost along with backups is not very encouraging... Tried this out for a short while. Interesting idea, but needs work. And it seemed to have a few bugs and balance problems. Great idea, I'm sorry to see it hasn't been developed much lately. I'd say that it was a good idea, if the phrase 'realistic Angband' didn't sound so funny. It's not realistic to kill hundreds of orcs single- handedly. It was a good idea, but a lost cause. (Not to mention that ID'ing all those item drops in the early game is a massive pain, and that several artifacts slipped by me that way.) ======================================================================== r2) [RobertAngband] (no comments) ======================================================================== s1) [Sangband] Played this and was quite impressed with all the differences. This was before the new maintainer. Seems to still be a work in progress. Hmm isnt this the one with skills ?, if so it was an unusual experience at least, far as i can remember it seemed a bit to easy to abuse the way skills improved, but still was fun The first non-vanilla variant i played, and i loved it. Shame about the balance :) (what balance? i hear you ask) I liked the ideas in this one. It's a pity the maintainer hasn't done anything with it in some time. Used to play this quite a lot - went back to it at the start of the year after finding a 'guide to Sangband skills' page on the Internet, which explained what you could actually aim to achieve, and what realistic levels for all the skills were. However, I haven't looked at it since. Was much cooler (albeit more munchkinish) in version 0.9.4b. I remain yet to be convinced that Angband can work at all with a skill system, but if this wasn't the most balanced attempt it could at least be the most fun. Great idea - never re-balanced though to keep you from creating truly twinkish powers and abilities. I haven't played this in years, but IIRC it was quite unbalanced (fenneling, skill system, etc.) and easy to win. Ok, fenneling is great fun and I like skill systems. I think I figured out that this was broken all by myself. Fun though. Skill-based. Very fun at start, but after you learn to optimise your playing style changes to too easy. Nice skill system Might someday be a playable game. From there, might someday be a great game, though one very different from *band mainstream. ======================================================================== s2) [SBFband] (no comments) ======================================================================== s3) [Silly Angband - Sillyband] (no comments) ======================================================================== t1) [Team Angband (TAngband)] (no comments) ======================================================================== u1) [Unnamed Angband (UnAngband)] Lots of great ideas. Needs some bugfixing and balancing however (which Andrew seems to be doing). I'm still getting used to the identify architecture (gauge magic, read magic, analyze magic, etc.) and I'm (at this point) not convinced it is an improvement. A variant without a name ready to make a name for itself. Rooms with special features: no magic casting, no melee, take poison damage, etc.. Say them beautiful words wif me: 400 different terrains. How much energy does the maintainer have!?! This too is one which sounds really interesting... once I'm bored of O, this is likely to be the next one I try out, if there is a decently stable version available. ======================================================================== u2) [Utumno] (no comments) ======================================================================== y1) [Ying-Yang Angband (Ying-YAngband)] (no comments) ======================================================================== z1) [Zangband] don't like walking between towns: use vanilla town option I'm looking forward to returning to it when new content starts being added. I'm going to wait until most of the changes are complete before I start playing it seriously again. Right now (2.6.2), I just find it alternately aggravating and boring, because of the shops and the new monster distribution. Favourite one, silly monsters on of course, dont we all love to hate those lephrechauns I played this for a long time, but stopped. To explain one of the main reasons why, a haiku: Monster v. monster Good, evil, epic battle Hit space key for - Loved 2.1.1c Fun. I like the direction it's going now. Quite fun and has some good features - another one I plan to get back to sometime. Didn't like some of the joke monsters (the greater hell-beast was sort of funny once, but now it's just a pain). Some of the races seemed overpowered compared to the basic ones. The one *true* way :) *the* trend-setter of the past few years. before it, i felt things were getting a bit static. established that silly is OK. Used to be my favorite, but it got annoying.. My third-favorite variant, and favorite dynasty :) If I'm not playing Vanilla or playtesting my own variant, this is most likely what I will be playing. A lot of fun, but in some aspects quite silly. =p All in all, an extremely enjoyable variant. Played 2.2.8 and 2.4.0. Haven't seen the latest versions, but I gather it seems to be going down the Pern route and becoming a totally different beast. I can't justify the disc space for both Zangband and Discband, so keep a backup of the *info files and swap them over occasionally - but mostly I play Discband now. Speaking as a DevTeam member, I think Zangband has gone downhill recently and we've made several mistakes in managing the expectations of players as well as getting new features completed in a timely fashion. The new wilderness has been deeply unpopular and the change to Oangband-style combat was controversial to say the least. That said, Steven Fuerst is doing a great job getting Zangband ready for the next stage of its devel- opment and I believe that once he is done it has the potential to be spectacular. 2.1.1c was IMHO the most balanced version yet, certainly the most balanced pre-O-combat. I still play it. I also like the 2.2.x series but haven't gone beyond 2.2.3d because of the absurd feature of good monsters fighting evil monsters spontaneously, and summoning things at each other, and getting completely out of hand. Anyone who wants to base a variant on the 2.2.x series of ZAngband should start with 2.2.3d for this reason. Z in gneral has huge amounts of code-bloat and just plain silly creatures and features. it is the opposite of V in philosophy. Z encourages you to break the rules and play in a twinkish manner as it has a hundred loopholes and things that are not even close to being balanced. Its fun for a while, but things like Cyberdeamons and Trump Tower ruin it for me. Excellent. not sure on this one, as a [Z] player I have my reservations about 2.6.2 as the shops seem to be less useful than in 2.2 - maybe I'll get back to you on this one when I've played it some more z2.2 town quests are fun and relatively easy at low-levels I, for one, like the direction the game is going. I hope to see a version with the spell system Topi (?) suggested a few years ago someday (lots of new spells to play with!!). Apart from Standard Angband itself, no variant has blazed so brightly over the past decade as Zangband. There has always been a role for a game that offered more and bigger, brighter and more colorful. From the early 90s to quite recently, Zangband filled that role. The problem facing the Zangband devteam today is not one of specific features or individual game design choices, but the blunt fact that, starting about a year and a half ago, Zangband got out- Zangbanded. The challenge now is to return Zangband to pride of place again. The choice is to compete with PernAngband and her kin, to compete with Oangband and hers, or somehow find a new, coherent path for a game that long made a living eshewing one. Somehow I don't like it as much as I used to. Playing the 2.0 and 2.1 series, this was my first variant that really showed a lot of difference - masses of new classes, races, and monsters. The only version with quests I played was 2.2.8 (and that convinced me that fixed quests should stay out of Angband). I'll try it again when there's a new magic system. Really nice. I wish there was an easier way to find one's way around the wilderness though. I do definately like the way all the different races - some of them pretty odd - are balanced. It's just that in the last year, Z has really spoiled me with the dungeon... love the way you can dive with fewer stop-points, new rooms and terrains are also great. It deserves its own page on Thangorodrim. That's all I have to say about it... I'm sure what they're doing is really quite brilliant, and I've never failed to be impressed by Z; but ever since they ventured away from the silly fixed quests and the silly wilderness and the silly V combat I'm just not so interested any more. It's great, and probably much better balanced and tighter than before, but that was never why I played Z. Also I hate torches. Very fun. Recently I've been playing the CVS - the occasional horrible bug makes the game more interesting. Prior to the new wilderness debacle, there was much fun to be had here. 2.5++ went a bit too experimental for me and they adopted the O-system. I also tried it when Steven experiemnted with quests at the start so I got the pleasure of testing it when it was unplayable past 1000'. It seems to have lost some lead to Pern wrt features, and might need a new killer-feature to attract me again. Topi ylinen versions are very fun. 2.4.0 is somewhat good and rest are boring as hell. It pretty much proves my point that more is not always better. Zangband has much more features than angband and is still boring (except early versions, where there was a lot of excitement) Do not play as much after Mindcrafters got...balanced:) I played this Variant the most. I'm really looking forward to a more interesting wilderness. Like the spell realms I think I tried this variant first, and I really like the idea of multiple towns and dungeons and the wilderness. That is, until I got killed several times after getting lost in the wilderness trying to find another town. But, I haven't played it enough to "critique" it. At some point in the future, when I'm better, I'll come back to it and give it another shot. Lots of fun stuff. Wilderness is a big ol' snoozing disaster. Set unique drops is a true disaster, particularly given Stormbringer is so badly broken. I used to play this one quite a lot, but after the set quests were removed I haven't really cared for this one. ======================================================================== z2) [Prfnoff's ZAngband variant (ZAngbaA)] (no comments) ======================================================================== z3) [Eric Bock's ZAngband variant (Zceband)] Hmm so many quests, good for when i'm feeling suicidal :) My second-favorite variant. Allowing 125 quests seems to have attracted the most masochistic players, whom I think are strange for killing characters in droves at 50' rather than just playing the game :D Evil Evil Evil. Make death swords multi-hued! I've played tk for the last year and I'm only just starting to get my ASCII skills back... :) Ooh. This one is lots of fun too, it puts the quests in [Z] to shame. If you want challenging quests, this is the variant to download. 125 quests is a great feature, and who couldn't like a variant based on Doom? :p It's surprisingly fun to take 125 quests and see how far you can get before being killed by horribly out-of-depth quest monsters... usually not very far.